Matt Forney
Spread the Word!

A Girl Explains How Not to Pick Up Girls

pick

This is a guest post by a female friend of mine.

As a female who openly interacts with an appreciable number of alt-right publications, I get a number of Facebook messages from young men who appear to be eager to take their very first swings at game in a safe space.

I mean, I hope that’s what they’re doing. If the messages I get are actual attempts to get under my skirt, then sex will never occur again and there’s no future for the human race.

I’m well aware that I’m not a man, and therefore have not had the opportunity to field test any gaming techniques on a sample of the female population; I only read game sites out of scientific curiosity, as they are a fascinating laboratory for applied evolutionary psychology. However, I have been a test subject, and thus I can provide a record of my reactions to the sample of males who have approached me as such.

And the abstract of my research would begin: y’all need to diversify.

Because at least ninety percent of the messages I get use negging. And more negging. And pretty much just that, aside from some painfully unfunny banter. Banter is great—it’s what we used to call “conversation”—but you need to do it for more than two floppy sentences before you start firing random insults.

Which is why I hope these guys are just experimenting, because it’s fairly safe to assume that they know I know that negging exists. And here’s the thing: once a girl has even the sketchiest idea of what game is about, you can no longer depend on the rules to keep working the same way.

Negging, for example, is supposed to bring results because it reduces a woman’s status, or her perception of her status, so that you seem higher in status by comparison.

However, if she knows that this is the purpose of negging, and she knows you know that, then negging is essentially telling her: “I think you’re too good for me, and I’m trying to bring you down to my level.” That is about as sexy as socks with sandals. And cargo shorts. You can argue logically with that all you like, but you can’t argue with results, or lack thereof.

Some attempts at negging are considerably sadder than others. Here’s a fairly extreme example of a “Don’t”: after failing to impress me with some witless banter about nothing, one interlocutor resorted to blurting, “You’re so old and fat.”

I guess he figured he had a fifty-fifty chance with “fat,” since 90 percent of women can be annoyed with either the word “fat” or the word “flat-chested.” But when a guy guesses the wrong way, it’s the equivalent of a telemarketer mispronouncing your name: you don’t even have to deal with it.

As for “old,” this guy needs an intro to the finer points of negging: as I understand it, the technique is meant to push the girl to regain the fellow’s approval by cutely, ineffectually protesting the neg.

There’s no cute, ineffectual way to protest the fact that the Earth keeps going around the sun. And if there’s a woman out there who thinks she’s so special that the Earth really did stop going around the sun the day she was born, you probably don’t even want to sleep with her once.

Some of you might be thinking: “Well, sure, this chick SAYS these negs were ineffective. But little does she know that barb resulted in a twelve percent increase in the likelihood that someday she’ll pay airfare to Vancouver just to have coffee with this sterling wit and take all her clothes off!”

Perhaps, but increasing zero by twelve percent is still zero.

I’m not saying that this stuff is necessarily a total waste of time. I have been successfully gamed, but by guys who had the personal qualities to back up their evo-psych tools. If you can make a woman laugh, for instance, everything else you do becomes more effective… but to make people laugh, there’s no substitute for a wide body of knowledge. The building blocks of jokes are everything that’s in your head. If there’s nothing in there, you’re going to wind up scuffing your feet and falling back on tricks that have already failed.

It’s a bit of an arms race: the more game becomes popularized, the more the basic techniques will be recognizable to women, and the more elaborate new tactics you’ll have to read up on.

Wouldn’t it be more fun to work on “inner game?”

As the writers on this site keep repeating, pickup isn’t the be-all—or at least it isn’t the end-all—of impressing the ladies. You can insult me till you’re blue in the face: if you’re a boring loser with no life, then all PUA techniques are going to be able to do for you is to get you on the road from being rejected by boring, loser land whales to being allowed to buy drinks for said BLLWs.

Which is, I guess, in a sense, an accomplishment of… some, er well… you can proudly say that it’s better than nothing.

But is “better than nothing” all you want to aim for? Get off Facebook, for Christ’s sake. Read a book and hit the gym and you won’t need to practice insulting old women.

Read Next: Narcissism, “Rape Culture” and Why Millennial Girls Are Monsters

  • DDDDDuane

    trying to read past the the first 2 paragraphs of this imbecile’s ebonics was nauseating…..
    I can’t believe this moronic gibberish was posted…Matt must be trying to bang this braindead mess….

  • enriquegp

    One message to this female friend, if it really is a girl… according o the byline it was written by Matt Forney… thing about game is that you have to make an ass out of yourself from time to time. All those examples of bad game? Of lame negs? If you, as a man, are taking a shot at game, there is a lot of embarrassing stuff that will come out of your mouth; even if you have perfect inner game. Moreover, depending on your location and the attitude of the girls, you could be perfectly smooth, with awesoe things going on in your life, in good shape, but sometimes one corny joke or one tiny bit of bad game is enough for a girl to walk away and make of you with her group of friends. This is a risk that men have to take. So, whether this is Matt Forney or an actual female friend.. have some sympathy. Game can be emotionally draining. Guys want to get laid and girls want to get laid.

  • All the articles on this blog say “Matt Forney” because installing a separate byline for guest posters would break the site. But cute conspiracy theory.

  • in_Dei_servitium

    I have no credibility on this subject, Forney. Also, who gives a toss what a loser like me thinks? If I thought this post was stupid, all I had to do was not comment. I opened my big fat mouth because Forney’s girlfriend made my feels hurt. If you need a permavirgin like me to spout off then you’ve got bigger problems.

    [CensorBot sez: The return of CensorBot is so, so glorious.]

  • Snakes on a Car

    Hey guuuuuuuuuurrrrrrrlllllllllllllllll
    I heard dat you be old n’ fat.

  • Grotchmanchowder

    Of all the guest articles you’ve posted, Matt, this is probably the one I laughed hardest at.

    I first noticed PUA stuff in high school, when a friend was really getting into the Mystery Method. And believe me, there are few things I find funnier than watching some jagoff fail miserably at Game. Granted, most people nowadays don’t dress up in zebra spandex pants and top hats like my friend did, but seeing morons trying to neg (which is honestly a tactic of game that I feel is utter bullshit) is almost as hilarious.

    And of course the comment section of this article already has two permavirgins crying about “HOW DARE YOU LET A VAGINOID WRITE AN ARTICLE”.

    (The truth of the matter is that I actually wrote this comment in a desperate attempt to get the girl who wrote this article to touch my shoulder. Sup gurl get back @ me)

  • LegallySpeaking

    Matt, you have admitted to writing as a female blogger in order to report on the experience. Enriquegp isn’t that far out there in questioning the authorship.

    Edit: I’m a fan of your writing, but as with everything on the interwebs, you need to view any statement made by anyone with a bit of skepticism, no matter what side of the argument it comes from or who makes it.

  • gesekkih584

    Well said. I agree 100% with this.

  • AM

    Well, the problem is that the men don’t understand the neg. The purpose of the neg isn’t to kill her already non-existent self-esteem. It’s to show that you have your own ideas and aren’t going to compromise them just for the chance of a woman’s affection. And with that latter purpose in mind, how you neg becomes something else entirely.

    So, for example, a girl says, “I believe in gender and racial equality,” and you say, “Equality’s such a vague word that’s always changing its meaning, I don’t even know what it means. People should just be themselves.” See? You told her she’s stupid without actually saying it. Whether that specifically brings you any closer to the girl depends on the girl, but it’s certainly more affective than agreeing with everything she says ever, because at least now you’re being honest instead of transparently fake. Women are expert bullshit detectors.

    A friend told me that when she met her husband, one of the first things he told her was, “If you brushed your hair, you’d look much prettier.” Gentle and leaderlike, not desperate and hostlle.

    I don’t have the best game in the world, but I’d never think telling a girl “Your nose is too big” would be a turn on. I only say things like that if she already rejected me and I just wanted to ruin the rest of her night. Heh heh heh…

  • bucky

    good post. i’d like to hear anonymous female poster’s opinion on roosh’s assertion that to get young, sexy american girls in their prime, either bad boy or clown game is required.

  • If you can make a woman laugh, for instance, everything else you do becomes more effective…

    That’s all you need to do. The rest follows.

    Now, how do you make women laugh? Be funny. How do you get funny?

    Here’s what James Altucher used to do, from his book Choose Yourself , which I kind of half heartedly recommend, but only because it’s just 99 cents:

    …my predate secret…before every date I would watch either Michael Cera doing comedy or Louis CK doing stand-up…I would be temporarily funnier with a half-life of about two hours.

    As is so often the case in life these days, YouTube is your friend here.

  • So, for example, a girl says, “I believe in gender and racial equality,” and you say,..

    You look at your watch and say, “Damn! I have to go pick up my mother from the hairdresser. Nice meeting you!” And move on.

  • Irish

    Wow, guys are still using the ‘neg’. Man, that takes me back…

  • Bo Jangles

    I think teasing usually works better word than negging, its kind of a challenge to a girl if done right. Usually the only women who respond well to outright insults are women who think they should be dating rock stars.

  • Good King Richard

    All this stuff is for young people. Rather than getting in and out of pants, has it ever occurred to us that men and women might just naturally like each other? (Without the competition bullshit?)

  • Driver

    I agree that the “neg” doesn’t really work unless you have a little back and forth banter. It’s well timed, it has to flow with the conversation and it may or may not work in all cases (may not be needed).

    A point that I’d like the writer to admit (as for women) is that there used to be a time when it wasn’t needed because women, also, brought a little bit more “to the table”. There is always this talk about how a man needs to be this, that or have a life (be fun, etc..) but many of the women I try to have a conversation with are pretty dull (or dumb) or no life themselves. Even the ones who clearly are giving the IOIs, once you get past a certain point, the lights are on but no one is home.

    Women (and society) are always talking about equality but when it gets down to it, it’s always the man who carries the burden of performance. Women don’t want to admit it but that’s how it is (similar to women joining the military – they have the option to join but, by law, all men must register for Selective Service – new term for the draft).

    Women can’t have it both ways. They want to be equal yet there still waiting for the man (only) to improve his life, game, etc…to qualify for their time (and rather dull life).

  • Pingback: Women: please stop negging us, it doesn’t work anymore | Philosophies of a Disenchanted Scholar()

  • Abba Okoro

    Interesting

  • “As sexy as socks with sandals” haha

  • Tall Tom

    “You know? I have have been told quite a bit about you online.”

    “But I do not care anything about what they say…You are alright in my book.”

    (Of course this brings about curiosity and allows her to know that she is important to you. Of course the Creep Factor may be a problem. But curiosity will still be there.).

    So when pressed about what “They said” your response is, “I don’t care about what they say. You are alright in my book….even though your shoes are untied.” (Diversion from the first topic.)

    And of course this is so general that it works best in any case.

    If they claim that their shoes are tied then you laugh and ask, “You looked???”

    “You think that the internet has windows?”

    “I know something about Windows but it is an Operating System and I am not the NSA spying on you on that camera in front of you…or am I? (Do NOT give them a chance to get a word in edgewise…You have reintroduced the Creep factor danger which needs to be immediately and completely defused by the following…)

    “What are you? Some sort of paranoid conspiracy nut?” Then follow that up with, “Are you mundane?” in a critical tone using appropriate emoticons. (Mundane means down to earth, well grounded in reality,,and is generally a compliment.) When they take offense (THEY WILL) then tell them that YOU ARE MUNDANE and what the word means.

    Then ask the question again, “Well…Are you mundane?”

    Then follow through with, “I am looking for a mundane lady as I am mundane also.” They may become apologetic as they somehow “offended you” at this point but just ignore it and invite her out to meet..

    The Creep factor should be completely defused and destroyed by this point. It needs to be dealt with early and destroyed. So you control the destruction of it by controlling the conversation.

    Trust is the issue. They feel vulnerable. Destroy the Creep factor and you will garner trust.

    ON THE OTHER HAND…

    If they claim that they are not wearing shoes then you respond,”See.I am right? Your shoes are untied, aren’t they?

    Then introduce the Windows routine and demolish the Creep factor..

    If they claim that they are wearing High Heels or sandals then you claim that you are right as you need not tie those shoes.

    Likewise introduce Windows and demolish the Creep factor.

    Fluidity is the key. The point is that if you can keep them off balance and laughing at themselves…WHILE BUILDING TRUST…and you,then create INTEREST which leads to fantasy and ideally igniting enough attraction to meet up with them.

    Without attraction you have ZERO CHANCE.

  • Hey maaaaaaaaaaaaaan!!!
    I heard you’ve never seen a woman naked before.

  • Roosh is a piece of trash. If you support him, you deserve to be burned alive and thrown into the ocean.

  • You’ve never given a woman an orgasm, have you?

  • Actually, anyone with half a brain can see that this was a fairly well-written article. And no – “neg” doesn’t count as ebonics. You’re just uneducated.

  • bucky

    based on my observations with real women in the real world, most of what roosh writes seems to be true. how do you do with women? do you find that being a nice guy and a gentleman gets you thin, attractive, feminine women? if so, what part of the world do you live in?

  • DDDDDuane

    “fairly well-written article”? ….To an IMBECILE who consumes Sh!t like video games, weed and khardashawhores on TV….
    I wouldn’t expect anything more “edumikated” from a “bargain bob”….

  • I wonder, where did you get the idea that I like video games and the Kardashians? I haven’t played video games since my balls dropped and I happen to think Kim Kardashian and her ignorant clown of a boyfriend are the two worst people on this entire planet.

    And an EDUCATED person would know that some of the greatest minds in human history all consumed marijuana regularly. But it doesn’t surprise me that you don’t.

    Now, I don’t READ any of that nonsense, but while we’re attacking eachother’s choice of “reading material,” I’d like you to scroll up about 20 inches and keep stirring the pot that called the kettle black.

  • I’m sorry, but you are a piece of garbage. Roosh supports legal rape. If you are aligning yourself in any way, blind violence is WARRANTED, especially considering rape is BLIND VIOLENCE.

    If women weren’t equal to men, the things you were saying MIGHT not be completely despicable. It doesn’t surprise me that a person like you can’t get laid without your partner calling the police afterwards.

  • bucky

    if i cared about your opinion of me i’d ask you to refrain from calling me a rapist. rape is a horrible crime and unlike you, i’ve never advocated any kind of violence here.

    let’s forget about that though, because your opinion of me isn’t important. can you cite any sort of quote or video or anything at all where roosh states that he supports rape in any way? if you can, i will stop supporting him.

  • And I only advocated violence against those who advocate violence against women. And I feel that is more than justified. I’m comfortable with that.

  • bucky

    no answer as to when roosh has advocated rape though, i see.

  • bucky

    have you read the article that they’re talking about? it’s clearly satire. are you familiar with jonathan swift? if not, he once wrote an article suggesting that the irish solve their endemic poverty by selling their children as food to the british. also satire.

  • I’m fully aware of what satire is.

    That’s what I thought at first. Roosh V is not satirical. This is proven. DNAinfo is not a satire website. This is not a satire story. Roosh V thinks it should be legal to rape women. And you are defending him. Congratulations.

  • bucky

    what are you talking about? what is dnainfo? i read the original article on roosh’s blog when it came out a year or two ago. have you read it? (you still haven’t answered that question.) i immediately recognized it as satire, but also recognized that his enemies would use it against him. it’s a shame. he is a good person and has helped a lot of guys see the truth and lead better lives, including me. i might not be with the woman i’m married to now if not for roosh’s advice and i am forever grateful to him for this.

  • Wow. You are truly a brainwashed fool. I hope you are locked up before you injure any innocent women. Don’t talk to me anymore. I don’t entertain rapists.

  • bucky

    “i have no coherent arguments and lose the debate,” in a rough manner of speaking.

  • Actually no. You aren’t equipped enough to continue the debate. In order to participate, you must have at least SOME knowledge of recent current events and the subject you are debating about. You have neither. Do some research. When you do, I’ll be happy to accept your apology.

  • bucky

    again, i read the original article that caused all the uproar when it came out. just saying “you’re wrong” doesn’t make me wrong. you still haven’t provided any evidence that roosh advocates rape, and you can’t because you’re lying.

  • Eve

    Of course negging doesn’t work even if she sleeps with you. That’s because sin is destructive. So everyone should just stop living in sin and have sex in marriage only. Men get a loyal woman (virgin) and women get an invested man, children are happy and have a safe place to grow up. As a Christian lady I really don’t believe there is any “right way” to sin, which is what game supposes. Game sites are the male equivalent of Jezebel, I know that PUAs think they are the opposite but but they appeal to the base desires of flawed male nature while feminism does the same with female nature. (Though I will admit that game and PUA sites are a response to feminism so yes women “started this” whole nonsense.) I have also noticed that both groups view sex as some sort of “game” and mere stimulation of the genitals (which explains the massive tolerance homosexuality in our culture) kind of like how bulimics view eating as a messaging of the tongue. Uncommitted sex can’t fufill people, even from an evolutionary (if you believe in that) standpoint such only feeds insecurity in both males and females, creates massive social anxiety and leaves children dead and/or abandoned.

    Sex may be a biological urge but at the end of the day I believe that man was designed by God with a spirit to rise above the flesh. When men and women learn this and stop living as hedonists all this man vs woman nonsense will end.

  • Gary Fencyk

    Finally someone that makes sense. Thank you!

    We live in a dying world that is on the fast track to hell and people are screaming to go faster. I pray that the Lord of Glory wouldn’t tarry much longer but in the mean time I pray that my brothers and sisters in Christ be carried through this sinful world and that we can be a light in this utter darkness so that some might be saved.